said, is a circumstance that affects me with most sensible pleasure, and does me the greatest honour. But two things fell from that gentleman, which give me pain, as whatever falls from that gentleman, falls from so great a height as to make a deep impression. I must endeavour to remove it. It was objected, that the notice given to parliament of the troubles in America was not early. I can assure the House, the first accounts were too vague and imperfect to be worth the notice of parliament. It is only of late that they have been precise and full. An over-ruling influence has also been hinted at. I see nothing of it; I feel nothing of it; I disclaim it for myself, and (as far as my discernment can reach), for all the rest of his Majesty's ministers.

Mr. Pitt said in answer to Mr. Conway, The excuse is a valid one, if it is a just one. That must appear from the papers now before the House.

done, he said:] When I proposed to tax America, I asked the House, if any gentleman would object to the right; I repeatedly asked it, and no man would attempt to deny it. Protection and obedience are reciprocal. Great Britain protects America; America is bound to yield obedience. If not, tell me when the Americans were emancipated? When they want the protection of this kingdom, they are always very ready to ask it. That protection has always been afforded them in the most full and ample manner. The nation has run itself into an immense debt to give them their protection; and now they are called upon to contribute a small share towards the public expence, an expence arising from themselves, they renounce your authority, insult your officers, and break out, I might almost say, into. open rebellion. The seditious spirit of the colonies owes its birth to the factions in this House. Gentlemen are careless of Mr. Grenville next stood up. He be- the consequences of what they say, progan with censuring the ministry very sevided it answers the purposes of oppoverely, for delaying to give earlier notice sition. We were told we trod on tender to parliament of the disturbances in Ame- ground; we were bid to expect disoberica. He said, They began in July, and dience. What was this, but telling the now we are in the middle of January; Americans to stand out against the law, lately they were only occurrences, they to encourage their obstinacy with the exare now grown to disturbances, to tumults pectation of support from hence? Let us and riots. I doubt they border on open only hold out a little, they would say, our ebellion; and if the doctrine I have friends will soon be in power. Ungrateheard this day be confirmed, I fear they ful people of America! Bounties have been will lose that name to take that of revolu- extended to them. When I had the hotion. The government over them being nour of serving the crown, while you dissolved, a revolution will take place in yourselves were loaded with an enormous America. I cannot understand the dif- debt, you have given bounties on their ference between external and internal lumber, on their iron, their hemp, and taxes. They are the same in effect, and many other articles. You have relaxed, only differ in name. That this kingdom in their favour, the Act of Navigation, that has the sovereign, the supreme legislative palladium of the British commerce; and power over America, is granted. It can- yet I have been abused in all the public not be denied; and taxation is a part of papers as an enemy to the trade of Amethat sovereign power. It is one branch of rica. I have been particularly charged the legislation. It is, it has been exercis- with giving orders and instructions to preed, over those who are not, who were vent the Spanish trade, and thereby stopnever represented. It is exercised over ping the channel, by which alone North the India Company, the merchants of America used to be supplied with cash for London, the proprietors of the stocks, and remittances to this country. I defy any over many great manufacturing towns. It man to produce any such orders or inwas exercised over the palatinate of Ches- structions. I discouraged no trade but ter, and the bishopric of Durham, before what was illicit, what was prohibited by they sent any representatives to parlia- act of parliament. I desire a West India ment. I appeal, for proof, to the pream- merchant, well known in the city (Mr. bles of the acts which gave them repre- Long), a gentleman of character, may be sentatives: the one in the reign of Henry examined. He will tell you, that I offer8, the other in that of Charles 2. [Mr. ed to do every thing in my power to adGrenville then quoted the acts, and desir-vance the trade of America. I was above ed that they might be read; which being giving an answer to anonymous calumnies;

off the aspersion.

Here Mr. Grenville ceased. members got up to speak, but

Several

but in this place, it becomes one to wipe | puted as a crime. But the imputation shall not discourage me. It is a liberty I mean to exercise. No gentleman ought to be afraid to exercise it. It is a liberty by which the gentleman who calumniates it might have profited. He ought to have profited. He ought to have desisted from his project. The gentleman tells us, America is obstinate; America is almost in open rebellion. I rejoice that America has resisted. Three millions of people, so dead to all the feelings of liberty, as voluntarily to submit to be slaves, would have been fit instruments to make slaves of the rest. I come not here armed at all points, with law cases and acts of parliament, with the statute-book doubled down in dogs-ears, to defend the cause of liberty: if I had, I myself would have cited the two cases of Chester and Durham. I would have cited them, to have shewn, that, even under any arbitrary reigns, parliaments were ashamed of tax

Mr. Pitt seeming to rise, the House was so clamorous for Mr. Pitt! Mr. Pitt! that the Speaker was obliged to call to order. After obtaining a little quiet, he said, Mr. Pitt was up! who began with informing the House, That he did not mean to have gone any further upon the subject that day: that he had only designed to have thrown out a few hints, - which, gentlemen who were so confident of the right of this kingdom to send taxes to America, might consider; might, perhaps, reflect in a cooler moment, that the right was at least equivocal. But since the gentleman, who spoke last, had not stopped on that ground, but had gone into the whole; into the justice, the equity, the policy, the expediency of the Stamp-Act, as well as into the right, he would follow him through the whole field, and combating a people without their consent, and alhis arguments on every point.

He was going on, when Lord Strange got up, and called both the gentlemen, Mr. Pitt, and Mr. Grenville, to order. He said, they had both departed from the matter before the House, which was the King's Speech; and that Mr. Pitt was going to speak twice on the same debate, although the House was not in a committee.

Mr. George Onslow answered, That they were both in order, as nothing had been said, but what was fairly deducible from the King's Speech; and appealed to the Speaker. The Speaker decided in Mr. Onslow's favour.

Mr. Pitt said, I do not apprehend I am speaking twice: I did expressly reserve a part of my subject, in order to save the time of this House, but I am compelled to proceed in it. I do not speak twice; I only finish what I designedly left imperfect. But if the House is of a different opinion, far be it from me to indulge a wish of transgression, against order. I am content, if it be your pleasure, to be silent. Here he paused-The House resounding with, Go on, go on; he proceeded:

Gentlemen, Sir, (to the Speaker) I have been charged with giving birth to sedition in America. They have spoken their sentiments with freedom, against this unhappy act, and that freedom has become their crime. Sorry I am to hear the liberty of speech in this House, im

lowed them representatives. Why did the gentleman confine himself to Chester and Durham? He might have taken a higher example in Wales; Wales, that never was taxed by parliament, till it was incorporated. I would not debate a particular point of law with the gentleman: I know his abilities. I have been obliged to his diligent researches. But, for the defence of liberty upon a general principle, upon a constitutional principle, it is a ground on which I stand firm; on which I dare meet any man. The gentleman tells us of many who are taxed, and are not represented-The India company, merchants, stock-holders, manufacturers. Surely many of these are represented in other capacities, as owners of land, or as freemen of boroughs. It is a misfortune that more are not actually represented. But they are all inhabitants, and, as such, are virtually represented. Many have it in their option to be actually represented. They have connexions with those that elect, and they have influence over them. The gentleman mentioned the stockholders: I hope he does not reckon the debts of the nation as a part of the national estate. Since the accession of king William, many ministers, some of great, others of more moderate abilities, have taken the lead of government.

He then went through the list of them, bringing it down till he came to himself, giving a short sketch of the characters of each of them. None of these, he said,

I thought, or ever dreamed, of robbing the Those estates sold then from fifteen to colonies of their constitutional rights. eighteen years purchase; the same may That was reserved to mark the æra of the be now sold for thirty. You owe this to late administration: not that there were America. This is the price that America wanting some, when I had the honour to pays you for her protection. And shall a serve his Majesty, to propose to me to miserable financier come with a boast, burn my fingers with an American Stamp- that he can fetch a pepper-corn into the Act. With the enemy at their back, exchequer, to the loss of millions to the with our bayonets at their breasts, in the nation! I dare not say, how much higher day of their distress, perhaps the Ameri- these profits may be augmented. Omitcans would have submitted to the impositing the immense increase of people, by tion; but it would have been taking an un-natural population, in the northern cologenerous, and unjust advantage. The gen-nies, and the migration from every part of tleman boasts of his bounties to America! Are not those bounties intended finally for the benefit of this kingdom? If they are not, he has misapplied the national treasures. I am no courtier of America, I stand up for this kingdom. I maintain, that the parliament has a right to bind, to restrain America. Our legislative power over the colonies is sovereign and supreme. When it ceases to be sovereign and supreme, I would advise every gentleman to sell his lands, if he can, and embark for that country. When two countries are connected together, like England and her colonies, without being incorporated, the one must necessarily govern; the greater must rule the less; but so rule it, as not to contradict the fundamental principles that are common to both.

The gentleman asks, when were the colonies emancipated? But I desire to know, when they were made slaves? But I dwell not upon words. When I had the honour of serving his Majesty, I availed myself of the means of information, which I derived from my office: I speak, therefore, from knowledge. My materials were good. I was at pains to collect, to digest, to consider them; and I will be bold to affirm, that the profits to Great Britain from the trade of the colonies, through all its branches, is two millions a year. This is the fund that carried you triumphantly through the last war. The estates that were rented at two thousand pounds a year, threescore years ago, are at three thousand pounds at present.

Europe, I am convinced the whole commercial system of America may be altered to advantage. You have prohibited, where you ought to have encouraged; and you have encouraged where you ought to have prohibited. Improper restraints have been laid on the continent, in favour of the islands. You have but two nations to trade with in America. Would you had twenty! Let acts of parliament in consequence of treaties remain, but let not an English minister become a customhouse officer for Spain, or for any foreign power. Much is wrong, much may be amended for the general good of the whole.

Does the gentleman complain he has been misrepresented in the public prints? It is a common misfortune. In the Spanish affair of the last war, I was abused in· all the news-papers, for having advised his Majesty to violate the law of nations with regard to Spain. The abuse was industriously circulated even in hand-bills. If administration did not propagate the abuse, administration never contradicted it. I will not say what advice I did give to the King. My advice is in writing, signed by myself, in the possession of the crown. But I will say, what advice I did not give to the King: I did not advise him to violate any of the laws of nations.

As to the report of the gentleman's preventing in some way the trade for bullion with the Spaniards, it was spoken of so confidently, that I own I am one of those who did believe it to be true.

The gentleman must not wonder he was not contradicted, when, as the minister, he asserted the right of parliament to tax America. I know not how it is, but there is a modesty in this House, which does not chuse to contradict a minister. I wish gentlemen would get the better of this modesty. Even that Chair, Sir, looks too often towards St. James's. If they do not, perhaps, the collective body may be