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No. 17.

(Extract.)

Mr. Jervoise to Earl Granvillle.-(Received September 2.)

Rome, August 27, 1870. I HAVE the honour to acknowledge the receipt of your Lordship's despatch of the 22nd instant, referring me to the directions given to Mr. Petre in 1849 and to Mr. Odo Russell in 1866.

In obedience to the orders with which I am now honoured, I beg to say, that should disorders unfortunately arise here, I shall at once take such steps as may seem most advisable to secure the protection of British Roman Catholic Ecclesiastics and their property, as well as that of any other British subjects and their property.

No. 18.

Sir A. Paget to Earl Granville.—(Received September 2.)

(Extract)
Florence, August 29, 1870.
THE Roman question is a subject of very anxious consideration on the part of the
Italian Government at this moment. The position is one of extreme difficulty.

On the one hand there is the September Convention; and nothing can have been more clear than the declaration of the Ministry in Parliament of their determination to uphold it, that is to say, "Not to invade, or allow to be invaded, the Pontifical States:" on the other, it is quite certain that the public mind in Italy will not be at rest until something has been done which shall give a partial, if not an entire, satisfaction to the national desires; and the feeling has recently become much more general, that it would be culpable on the part of the Government not to take advantage of the present moment to obtain such results as may at all events lead to, if they did not at once realize, a complete solution of the question.

The military measures adopted by the Government for the security of the Roman frontier, are stigmatized by the organs of the Democratic party as measures taken for the support of the Pope's temporal power; the September Convention is ignored, and the Democratic party, they say, does not intend to play into the hands of the Government by advancing against Rome, and thus affording to the Government the opportunity which they are denounced of seeking, for a violent repression of a national movement: this party, it is asserted, will omit no legal means for agitating the country with the object of obtaining the end (viz., the occupation of Rome as capital of Italy) which they have in view.

But outside the Revolutionary party there is undoubtedly a very decided movement in public opinion, generally; in favour of action at the present moment. This is evident from the tone of recent debates, both in the Chamber of Deputies and Senate, as well as from that of the independent press. The explanations, indeed, of Signor Sella before the Senate, are an indication that the Government itself, while adhering to their international engagements, are penetrated with the necessity of putting an end, at the earliest possible moment, to the present unsatisfactory condition of things in regard to Rome. Between a policy of immediate occupation of Rome," said Signor Sella, "and a persistence in a contemplative policy there is a middle course, viz., to take advantage of any opportunity which may arise for advancing a solution of the Roman question."

Undoubtedly the event which would be most satisfactory to the Italian Government would be, that the Pope should himself consent to enter into friendly negotiations with them; but this, of course, is wishing for an impossibility, and may consequently be dismissed from consideration.

Should there, however, be a revolution amongst the Pope's subjects, the Italian Government will, I imagine, at once send troops to Rome. They will advance for the protection of the Head of the Church, and the temporal question will be treated afterwards.

The Italian Government will not, as far as my information goes, march, without provocation, to Rome, as advocated by the party of action. But if, as above stated, there is a movement in Rome, or if a Republic is proclaimed in France, the Italian Government will, I believe, not hesitate to advance their troops at once upon the Roman capital. Apart from other considerations the maintenance of tranquillity in Italy would in either case require the adoption of such a course.

These, however, are contingencies which may possibly never occur. The party of action in Rome, I hear, is not likely to rise except for its own immediate profit.

The only thing which can positively be said, therefore, at this moment is that the Italian Government are, as. stated at the beginning of this despatch, seriously preoccupied by the question of Rome; and while still animated with the desire of adhering to their international engagements, will not fail to profit by any circumstances which enable them to advance the solution of the Roman question in the sense of the national programme.

may

The Pope's departure from Rome would, I think, be deplored as a great misfortuna by the Italian Government, who are prepared to treat His Holiness as head of the Catholic Church with every respect and circumstance becoming that position.

I was asked a few days ago by the Secretary General for Foreign Affairs, whom I saw instead of M. Visconti Venosta, and with whom I had some conversation on the Roman affair, whether the "Defence" had come to Civita Vecchia to take away the Pope, to which I replied that she was probably there with a view to protect British subjects, and to afford them a refuge in the case of disturbances in the Roman States.

Sir,

No. 19.

Earl Granville to Mr. Jervoise.

Foreign Office, September 6, 1870. I HAVE received and laid before the Queen your despatch of the 27th ultimo, reporting your proceedings with regard to the presence of Her Majesty's ship" Defence " at Civita Vecchia ;" and I have to acquaint you that your conduct in the matter is entirely approved.

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(Extract.)

Sir A. Paget to Earl Granville.-(Received September 9.)

Florence, September 5, 1870. I MENTIONED in my despatch that the Democratic Party had announced LON the intention of availing themselves of every legal means for agitating the country on the Roman question with the view of forcing the Government to take possession of Rome. They are keeping their word.

Yesterday there was a meeting at Milan, at which the immediate occupation of Rome was proposed. Meetings of a similar nature and for a similar object were intended to be held at Turin and Parma.

My Lord,

No. 22.

Lord Lyons to Earl Granville.-(Received September 11.)

Paris, September 10, 1870. I HAD the day before yesterday the honour to inform your Lordship by telegraph that both the Nuncio and the Italian Minister had reason to believe that the occupation of the Roman States by the Italian troops would not be viewed with displeasure by the present French Government.

In fact, I had heard this both from Monsignor Chigi, the Nuncio, and from the Chevalier Nigra, the Italian Minister.

M. Nigra told me this afternoon that M. Jules Favre had authorized him to assure his Government not only of the acquiescence of the French Government, but also of its sympathy.

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I have, &c.

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My Lord,

No. 23.

Sir A. Paget to Earl Granville.-(Received September 12.)

Florence, September 6, 1870. NOT having succeeded in seeing M. Visconti Venosta yesterday, although I was twice at the Foreign Office and waited for a considerable time, I wrote to his Excellency a note informing him that your Lordship confirmed what I had already stated, viz., that the "Defence" had come to Civita Vecchia for the protection of British interests, and instructed me, moreover, to inform the Italian Government that there had been no communication received from nor made to the Pope, but that if His Holiness should ask for protection the Captain of the "Defence" would have orders to receive him on board.

This morning I received a reply from his Excellency, in which, while tendering his thanks to your Lordship for this communication, he expressed the wish that in the event of the Pope desiring to leave Rome, Her Majesty's Government would use their influence to persuade him that under no circumstances would His Holiness have anything to fear from Italy, either as regards his security, his independence, or his dignity; and that it was in conciliation that would be found the best guarantees for the Papacy and the Church.

Later in the day I saw M. Visconti Venosta, when I asked his Excellency whether any, and what, decision had been taken by the Italian Government in regard to the occupation of the Roman States.

In reply, his Excellency at once referred to an article which is to be found in this morning's "Opinione," and in which it is stated that the proclamation of the Republic at Paris, the formation of the Provisional Government, and of a Ministry composed of men who were not compromised by any engagements towards Rome, and many of whom were opposed to the expedition sent by General Cavaignac in 1848, or had combated the September Convention, must inevitably modify the relations between France and Italy in regard to the Roman question; that in view of these events the Ministry had laid aside all hesitation, and had determined to proceed resolutely to the fulfilment of the national will by going to Rome; that the Ministry were unanimous; that they had further deliberated upon making known to Europe, by means of a Memorandum, the sentiments by which they were animated, and the guarantees which they were prepared to accord to the Pope for the free exercise of his spiritual functions and for the splendour of the Holy See; that these guarantees would be strengthened by the consent they would receive from foreign Powers; that the Government will inform the Holy See of the resolution taken, offering, at the same time, every guarantee which might be thought necessary for its safety; and that an eminent political man was to be sent for this purpose to the Holy Father.

This programme M. Visconti Venosta said was entirely erroneous, and it was his intention to give it a formal contradiction in the official paper of this evening.

No doubt, his Excellency continued, the proclamation of the Republic at Paris and the consequent agitation both in Italy and in the Roman States might make it necessary to occupy certain portions of the Roman territory, and possibly a part of Rome itself, should there be disturbances there and the assistance of Italian troops be required for the protection of the Pope and to prevent the establishment of a Revolutionary Government. Such, his Excellency said, might possibly be the course which the Italian Government might have to adopt; but he repeated more than once that no absolute decision had yet been taken. If the Pontifical territory was occupied, the ultimate solution of the question as to the future position of the Pope, &c., would be reserved for deliberation with other Powers, and in the meantime every guarantee would be given for the security and independence of the Holy See. A violent conquest of Rome, such as was advocated by some, would certainly not be made; and, moreover, if circumstances rendered it necessary for the Italian troops to enter the Pontifical States and to go to Rome, they would at any rate stop short on this side of the Tiber, so as to allow the Pope a free and independent residence in the Leonine city.

I inquired of M. Visconti Venosta whether his meaning was that the Italian troops should only proceed with the occupation of the Roman States in proportion as certain places might be disturbed and the presence of Italian troops become necessary for the maintenance of order; to which his Excellency replied that it might become the duty of the Italian Government not only to put down, but, by acting in time, to prevent revolutionary movements. The Italian troops, he added, could not be employed simply as the Pope's gendarmes. The intervention would not be for the subversion of the Pope's authority, but nevertheless, in places occupied by Italian troops the populations would be

at liberty to reorganize their municipal institutions and to express their wishes as to their future political destiny, which would have to be considered when the definitive solution of the whole question came to be deliberated upon in concert with the other Powers.

Such is, I believe, a correct report of M. Visconti Venosta's views, as explained to me to-day.

In the meantime the agitation amongst the Democratic party, and the general movement throughout the country, is rapidly becoming stronger, and has increased in intensity since the proclamation of the Republic in France. Notwithstanding the assertion of M. Visconti Venosta that no absolute decision has as yet been taken, I cannot bring myself to believe that things are not somewhat further advanced than they would appear to be from his Excellency's declarations. In fact, I shall feel a good deal astonished if many days are allowed to pass over without steps being taken for obtaining some practical guarantee for the solution of the Roman question in conformity with the national wishes; and, moreover, if there is any hesitation at the present moment, I cannot but attribute it, in some degree at all events, to a not unnatural desire on the part of the Italian Government for communication, before taking any decided step, with the new French Government, from whom, considering its composition and antecedents, they probably do not expect to find much difficulty in dealing with the affairs of the Pope.

The Government may be perfectly sincere in saying that they do not intend to make a violent conquest of Rome, but in the possible case of a conflict in the streets of the city between the populace and the mercenaries of the Pope, is the Italian army to stand outside the walls passive spectators of the strife? It is quite impossible that they can do so, and any Government which authorized it would be overwhelmed by popular indignation and fury, and could not stand an hour. The expressed intention not to make the violent conquest of Rome is therefore, it seems to me, only of relative value.

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P.S. September 7.-The official Gazette of last evening states that the article in the 'Opinione," above referred to, is incorrect.

No. 24.

A. P.

My Lord,

Sir A. Paget to Earl Granville.—(Received September 12.)

Florence, September 8, 1870. I SAW M. Visconti Venosta this morning, when his Excellency informed me that the Government had now arrived at the conclusion that the occupation of certain portions of the Papal territory by the Italian troops had become necessary for the maintenance of order and tranquillity in the Peninsula. The Proclamation of the French Republic had given an impulse to agitation both in Italy and in the Papal States to which it was impossible that the Government could be indifferent. It was consequently intended to send Signor Ponza di San Martino to Rome this evening with an autograph letter from the King to the Pope, in which His Majesty would explain the circumstances which rendered it necessary for him to act; would state that the Italian troops would enter the Roman territory with the view to the maintenance of order and tranquillity, and that their presence would not prejudge any question. The letter would contain the most ample assurances of the respect which was entertained for the Holy Father, of protection for his person and independence, and would appeal to His Holiness to accept in a conciliatory spirit a step which had become necessary in the interests of order and regular Government throughout the Peninsula.

M. Visconti Venosta added, in reply to my inquiry, that the troops would not cross the frontier until His Holiness' answer had been received. He repeated what he had told me the other day that, although the populations of the places occupied would be at liberty to organize their municipal institutions and express their wishes as to their future political destiny, nothing would be settled by the fact of the occupation itself. That, in short, everything in that respect would be left for future negotiation with other Powers. His Excellency, moreover, repeated and authorized me to report to your Lordship that the Italian troops would stop at the walls of Rome, or, at all events, not employ force for entering unless under very extreme circumstances. In no case, however, his Excellency said, would the Italian troops enter the Leonine city while the Pope was there, except with the consent of His Holiness.

M. Visconti Venosta, however, stated that if the Italian troops met with resistance from the Papal forces in the Provinces, they would be obliged to overcome it. He trusted, however, he said, that the Pope would see the necessity of the movement; that it was impossible in the present excitement in Italy and the Roman States that things should any longer continue as they had done: in short, that it was for the interest of His Holiness himself, the future position of the Papacy, &c., as well as for that of monarchy in Italy, that the Italian Government should prevent any attempt at revolutionary movements, and that His Holiness would, therefore, neither resist the Italian troops nor leave Rome.

The Italian Government did not desire to precipitate matters, and, the cause of order being assured, things might be left for a long while in a provisional state,

M. Visconti Venosta said that he should be extremely grateful to Her Majesty's Government if they would give counsels to the Pope to be conciliatory, and not to leave the Vatican. His Excellency is evidently much pre-occupied at the possibility of His Holiness taking this step or giving his troops orders to resist the occupation. The places which I believe will be first occupied will be Viterbo and Civita Vecchia.

In reply to a further inquiry of mine, M. Visconti Venosta informed me that the French Government, to whom he had announced the necessities and intentions of the Italian Governments, had recognized that Italy had now recovered her liberty of action as far as regards the September Convention; and he also informed me that his communications with other Governments in regard to the contemplated occupation had been satisfactory.

I have, &c.

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I HAVE the honour to inclose herewith a Memorandum which has been communicated to me by M. Blanc, the Secretary-General of the Foreign Department, and which is probably that alluded to in the article of the "Opinione" quoted in my despatch of the 6th instant.

This Memorandum contains an account of the various negotiations which have taken place for the settlement of the question of the temporal power, the Pope's future position, &c.; and gives a résumé of the bases of a definitive solution which have at various times been recognized as acceptable, which bases of solution the Italian Government is still prepared to adopt.

I have, &c.

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Memorandum stating the Views of the Italian Government on the Roman Question.

AUSSITOT après la réunion des provinces méridionales au Royaume (21 Octobre, 1860), Rome étant occupée par les troupes du Général Goyon, et les relations entre la France et l'Italie étant rendues difficiles par les hésitations de l'Empereur à reconnaître le nouveau Royaume, et par les obstacles mis par la marine Française au blocus de Gaëte, le Comte de Cavour chargea deux négociateurs de traiter avec la Cour de Rome, que l'application du principe de non-intervention disposait à se rapprocher de l'Italie. Dès Novembre 1860 le Comte Cavour formulait un projet d'accord avec le Saint Siége sur la base de la pleine liberté de l'Eglise et de la cessation complète du pouvoir temporel du Pape. Le Gouvernement Français, à qui ce projet d'accord fut communiqué, fit envoyer à Turin un contre-projet fondé sur la restitution en principe au Pape de ses anciens domaines et sur la transformation de son pouvoir en un simple droit de haute Souveraineté (27 Décembre, 1860). Le Comte Cavour repoussa absolument ce contre-projet, et réserva son opinion sur un autre contre-projet qui restreignait la souveraineté temporelle du Pape à la cité Léonine.

Le projet d'arrangement direct entre l'Italie et le Saint Siége proposé par le Comte Cavour fut présenté le 10 Janvier, 1861, par le Cardinal Santucci au Pape, qui,

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